Original Batwoman (Kathy Kane)

First appearing in 1956, Kathy Kane was "Batwoman" in the pre-CoIE DC universe, later meeting her death in 1979. More recently, the character was revived by Grant Morrison in the pages of Batman Incorporated, though there had been references to the earlier Batwoman prior to that.







You can see the full story at Atomic Surgery.

That's a great story

Lucy McGough wrote:That's a great story

She was a fun character, as was Betty Kane as Bat-Girl.

Most of the stories about female bat-based heroes seem to centre around people telling them, "You must never be Batwoman/girl again! It's far too dangerous!"

Glad Batwoman got another outing after Batman nicked her portrait, though.

Some further cover appearances of Kathy Kane as Batwoman:

and while it wasn't Kathy Kane as Batwoman, . . .


if you want to talk about slightly silly bad guys, . . .

Silogramsam wrote:

You're getting a wee bit ahead of me, son.

Ah, the realism of the early 1960s comic books!

"Good grief! Batman and Robin have been transformed into alien beings with enormous bosoms!"

Lucy McGough wrote:"Good grief! Batman and Robin have been transformed into alien beings with enormous bosoms!"

I think they have more of a uni-chest than developed melons.   

Lucy McGough wrote:"Good grief! Batman and Robin have been transformed into alien beings with enormous bosoms!"

Looks more like they've got COPD.

(NOTE: That's Batwoman in the Baymobile along with Robin)




(Okay, Batwoman didn't make the cover, but how can I pass on Bat-Girl and Bat-Mite?   

While she wasn't on the cover, Kathy made a brief appearance in Batman #147.

"That kissing bug!"

Lucy McGough wrote:"That kissing bug!"

Y'know, since she was so easily fooled by the silhouette from a cardboard shape, it's unbelievable that she wasn't killed by some amazingly obscure loser Batman villain back then.

Batwoman appeared in several issues of Batman and Detective Comics after Batman #147, but her next cover appearance was Detective Comics #307.



That was followed by Batman #153.

But was she an Earth One or an earth Two character? Or both?

tony ingram wrote:But was she an Earth One or an earth Two character? Or both?

I'm not sure, but I think she was an Earth-One character originally. With a first appearance in 1956, that would generally be thought of more as early Silver Age rather than Golden Age.

Later on, though, they introduced the idea of there also being an Earth-2 version in a couple of Brave and the Bold appearances.

Bat-Girl, meanwhile, was very definitely an Earth One character (I don't think we ever saw an Earth Two version) and yet when Alex Luthor recreated Earth Two in Infinite Crisis, Bette Kane was transported there along with the JSA. All very confused.

By the way, happened to stumble across this:



from June 14th, 2006: "Criminals Are A Superstitious Cowardly Lot"
http://www.politedissent.com/index.php?s=sheldon+moldoff&submit=search

tony ingram wrote:All very confused.

I think it's another of those things that came about because the writer forgot where people were supposed to go. It's never bothered me, as I think the idea that Crisis was necessary because of these mistakes was ludicrous, but some people are bothered.
I do wonder how Geoff Johns got a reputation as someone who loves DC's older stuff. He seems to either not know or doesn't care about a lot of things from Pre-Crisis times. Which is fine, do what you need to do for the story (except Infinite Crisis which was supposed to build on history but kept getting it wrong) but don't get that reputation.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bette_Kane

"Flamebird appeared in Infinite Crisis #4 to fight Superboy-Prime. In this storyline, it was indicated that Flamebird had originally been the Earth-Two counterpart to Bat-Girl, and that after the Crisis on Infinite Earths, Flamebird had replaced Bat-Girl on the sole remaining Earth. Flamebird, along with most of the Justice Society, disappeared when Earth-Two was reborn."

That confuses matters even more, since 'Flamebird' never existed pre-Crisis (not that Flamebird, anyway). Sometimes, I wish the Anti-Monitor's antimatter wave would consume Wikipedia...

tony ingram wrote:That confuses matters even more, since 'Flamebird' never existed pre-Crisis (not that Flamebird, anyway). Sometimes, I wish the Anti-Monitor's antimatter wave would consume Wikipedia...

I think it was meant to be that Flamebird DID exist Pre-Crisis, we just never saw her. And then, like Powergirl, she became the version saved in Crisis, and so we saw her after. That's what I get out of it.

I find Wikipedia to be useful. Not always correct, but mostly useful.

Mbast1 wrote:

tony ingram wrote:That confuses matters even more, since 'Flamebird' never existed pre-Crisis (not that Flamebird, anyway). Sometimes, I wish the Anti-Monitor's antimatter wave would consume Wikipedia...

I think it was meant to be that Flamebird DID exist Pre-Crisis, we just never saw her. And then, like Powergirl, she became the version saved in Crisis, and so we saw her after. That's what I get out of it.

I find Wikipedia to be useful. Not always correct, but mostly useful.

I think if she existed pre-Crisis it would logically have been as a previously unconfirmed Bat-Girl of Earth Two, since there was a Batwoman of Earth Two.

tony ingram wrote:I think if she existed pre-Crisis it would logically have been as a previously unconfirmed Bat-Girl of Earth Two, since there was a Batwoman of Earth Two.

Given the way female characters are often just derivatives of the males, sure, this is probably what she would have been called if she were shown. But, then we have Powergirl. So, it's not an absolute.
Plus, let's be honest, they're really just making it up as they go along.

Mbast1 wrote:
Plus, let's be honest, they're really just making it up as they go along.

I am shocked that you could even suggest such a thing!

tony ingram wrote:I am shocked that you could even suggest such a thing!

I feel as though I should say something about gambling.

tony ingram wrote:Sometimes, I wish the Anti-Monitor's antimatter wave would consume Wikipedia...

Noooooooooooo!

I like Wikipedia. I give them money every year.

Mbast1 wrote:female characters are often just derivatives of the males

Distaff counterparts, innit.

Mbast1 wrote:

tony ingram wrote:I am shocked that you could even suggest such a thing!

I feel as though I should say something about gambling.

But he doesn't have anything to do with this, does he?

Gotta love a man in a frilled shirt. Very Jon Pertwee.

Ah, Steven Sharpe III! A very underrated villain.

Lucy McGough wrote:I like Wikipedia. I give them money every year.

Same here.

Lucy McGough wrote:Distaff counterparts, innit.

Sure, but it would be nice for them to have their own identities.

MajorHoy wrote:But he doesn't have anything to do with this, does he?

Better him than this, I guess:

http://www.tvacres.com/west_gambler.htm

Mbast1 wrote:

MajorHoy wrote:But he doesn't have anything to do with this, does he?

Better him than this, I guess:

http://www.tvacres.com/west_gambler.htm

I like the song, though.
(Somewhere among my vinyl record albums I think I have a Best of Kenny Rogers collection. It might even have his duet with Dolly Parton, Islands in the Stream.)

Why does the title "Islands in the Stream" always make me imagine Dolly Parton lying in the bath?

tony ingram wrote:Why does the title "Islands in the Stream" always make me imagine Dolly Parton lying in the bath?

Or doing the backstroke?

Previously, . . .

MajorHoy wrote: . . . followed by Batman #153.

In her next cover appearance, Batwoman becomes . . . Cat-Woman?!?


from Detective Comics #318 (August 1963).

But by 1964, when editor Julius Schwartz changed directions for Batman and Robin, Kathy Kane and her niece Betty disappeared from the Bat-books except for appearances in reprinted stories. It wasn't until 1977 that Kathy returned in a new comic book story, but this time with the Barbara Gordon version of Batgirl.

Was this before or after Kathy cropped up in Freedom Fighters?

tony ingram wrote:Was this before or after Kathy cropped up in Freedom Fighters?

Batman Family #10 was cover-dated March/April 1977.


Freedom Fighters #14 was cover-dated May/June 1978.

In between those two appearances, Batwoman appeared in Batman Family #14 (October 1977)


As well as in a story with Batgirl and Huntress (Earth-2's Helena Wayne) in Batman Family #17 (April/May 1978).

Interesting. I could rarely find issues of Batman Famiy, so I don't think I saw any of those.

tony ingram wrote:Interesting. I could rarely find issues of Batman Famiy, so I don't think I saw any of those.

Batman Family was always one of those thicker "Giant" comic books, with reprints included in issues #1-10 (for some reason, #2 was an all-reprint issue as a matter of fact) and then all new stories starting with issue #11. It went from being a "Giant" size to an even larger (and more expensive) "Dollar Comic" with issue #17, but #20 (October-November 1978) was its final issue as a stand-alone title.
By the time the next issue would have come out, it had merged into Detective Comics (issue #481, cover-dated December 1978-January 1979), which now went to the "Dollar Comic" size.

MajorHoy wrote:

tony ingram wrote:Interesting. I could rarely find issues of Batman Famiy, so I don't think I saw any of those.

Batman Family was always one of those thicker "Giant" comic books, with reprints included in issues #1-10 (for some reason, #2 was an all-reprint issue as a matter of fact) and then all new stories starting with issue #11. It went from being a "Giant" size to an even larger (and more expensive) "Dollar Comic" with issue #17, but #20 (October-November 1978) was its final issue as a stand-alone title.
By the time the next issue would have come out, it had merged into Detective Comics (issue #481, cover-dated December 1978-January 1979), which now went to the "Dollar Comic" size.

Ah, now that reminds me of something! I'm sure I once heard that the merger with Detective was because Batman Family was actually selling better and Detective was on the point of cancellation, but they didn't want to lose the title. Any truth in that?

tony ingram wrote:I'm sure I once heard that the merger with Detective was because Batman Family was actually selling better and Detective was on the point of cancellation, but they didn't want to lose the title. Any truth in that?

I've heard that as well, but I don't know how much truth may have been involved in that. Also, this was right around the time of the "DC Implosion" when the company was reducing its product line.

MajorHoy wrote:

tony ingram wrote:I'm sure I once heard that the merger with Detective was because Batman Family was actually selling better and Detective was on the point of cancellation, but they didn't want to lose the title. Any truth in that?

I've heard that as well, but I don't know how much truth may have been involved in that. Also, this was right around the time of the "DC Implosion" when the company was reducing its product line.

I remember. We lost Freedom Fighters, SSOSV, Shade, Kamandi, Steel, Black Lightning, All-Star Comics, Karate Kid, Star Hunters...loads of books I loved, all in a fairly short space of time.

tony ingram wrote:We lost Freedom Fighters, SSOSV, Shade, Kamandi, Steel, Black Lightning, All-Star Comics, Karate Kid, Star Hunters...loads of books I loved, all in a fairly short space of time.

Was that the DC implosion, or something else?

Mbast1 wrote:

tony ingram wrote:We lost Freedom Fighters, SSOSV, Shade, Kamandi, Steel, Black Lightning, All-Star Comics, Karate Kid, Star Hunters...loads of books I loved, all in a fairly short space of time.

Was that the DC implosion, or something else?

Karate Kid, Freedom Fighters and a few other titles were cancelled earlier in '78 for unrelated reasons. But All-Star Comics, Kamandi, Steel, Shade, Star Hunters, SSOSV and Black Lightning were among the titles cancelled as part of the implosion. At least thirty titles were cancelled in 1978, twenty of them being totally unplanned cancellations.

tony ingram wrote:Karate Kid, Freedom Fighters and a few other titles were cancelled earlier in '78 for unrelated reasons. But All-Star Comics, Kamandi, Steel, Shade, Star Hunters, SSOSV and Black Lightning were among the titles cancelled as part of the implosion. At least thirty titles were cancelled in 1978, twenty of them being totally unplanned cancellations.

I find that period interesting. For a while I saw things labelled "cancelled comics cavalcade" for sale online, but I didn't buy them. I kinda wish I had.

Mbast1 wrote:

tony ingram wrote:Karate Kid, Freedom Fighters and a few other titles were cancelled earlier in '78 for unrelated reasons. But All-Star Comics, Kamandi, Steel, Shade, Star Hunters, SSOSV and Black Lightning were among the titles cancelled as part of the implosion. At least thirty titles were cancelled in 1978, twenty of them being totally unplanned cancellations.

I find that period interesting. For a while I saw things labelled "cancelled comics cavalcade" for sale online, but I didn't buy them. I kinda wish I had.

So do I. It would have been fascinating to finally read some of those truncated stories. I think a couple of unpublished issues of SSOSV were eventually published in a trade a few years ago, but I could never justify the expense.